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And I have actually been honored to fulfill them and proud to invite them. Chairman Leahy. As my last concern, in some of the testament this morning there has actually been an idea that, of training course, just with all the hundreds of billions, trillions of bucks ready to invest, you need to just go someplace else.

Stenger. I would tell you that in this environment the capability to increase capital for things we are doing would have-- it is impossible to do so in a fashion that would certainly enable us as effectively and as promptly produce things we have actually done. You can borrow money if you have actually obtained half down.

I could have obtained fifty percent of that if I had the $12 million in cash to install. Every person understands that, yes, financial institutions have cash to car loan as long as you have actually got half of it in your pocket before you ask for the various other half. That is not how business works these days.

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You are speaking from a real-world experience, not from a think tank experience. I will certainly leave that simply as a gratuitous remark from the Chairman. Legislator Grassley. Senator Grassley. Thank you. I intend to be accountable in this problem of undocumented employees. I want to confess that we just have unscientific information, yet I want to ask you to what level you need to go or do most likely to make certain that the facilities ensure that the financial investments do not produce jobs for people below illegally.

Mr. Stenger. We have employed-- as I stated, at the Optimal we had 550 construction workers on our job.

They are comprised of 10, 15, 20, 30 staff members. They are from our neighborhood counties. They are Vermonters. They are benefiting directly from the investment. So we are a hands-on facility. I recognize the employees, I recognize their households, and we have had the ability to employ-- through these last 3 years of horrible economic turmoil, we have had the ability to use practically every building employee in our county and the surrounding areas.

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citizens. They live in the location. Their households exist. They are purchased the communities, and they are all united state workers. Senator Grassley. You do not have to utilize e-verify, but I want to understand whether you do. Mr. Stenger. We do. Senator Grassley. You do.

Thanks. Mr. North, along the same lines of the concern I asked him, has your research study shown instances other-- and I just gave one instance, so I want to confess that and be accountable concerning it-- of facilities hiring undocumented people? Mr. North. That type of information is extremely tough to acquire from USCIS, and I should state that what we do find out about most of the internal features of that company as for this program is concerned associates to situations in which the staff has stated no to an application of some kind and afterwards the regional facility or the individual business owner has actually gone to the Administrative Appeals Workplace-- which is part of the company-- and there we obtain documents, we get a hearing officer informing us what is click here going on in that specific situation.



This is a bad application." There is a quantity of bad applications out there, yet just as soon as that procedure obtains before an administrative law court do we see much in the way of information. Now, there was one instance that you stated, and allow me just elaborate on that particular a little.

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Do not take as well long since I want to ask one more pair questions. Go ahead and promptly coating. Mr. North. The milk farm had actually claimed 17 workers, and they entered into it, and the judge discovered that 16 of them were illegals. Now, that is the one example I have, and it is a fine example.

Okay. I am mosting likely to ask different inquiries of each of the three of you, but it manages this set concern. As I stated in my opening declaration, I am worried about the potential loophole that enables financiers to withdraw their financial investment in local facilities after getting their permit.

Mr. Divine. I would claim that most of the financiers, if you asked them what are their goals, they would certainly state, "I want to obtain an environment-friendly card, and I desire to keep it.

Mr. Divine. Let me ask Mr. Stenger, is it usual for an investor in your experience to withdraw his or her financial investment promptly after obtaining a copyright? Mr.

Senator, no.

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